Ben Sondgeroth
You know, you had to write a reflection after your lesson and how it went, you know, I was a college kid, I didn’t want to do anything more than I had to. And I’d be like, Why do I have to do one more thing and then I like started understand that like, that’s how you learn, you analyze what happened in the past to make better choices in the future. And I think that’s really important for kids to both in the classroom to have them reflect. And so when we talk about doing that with our kids, like it’s important, I think, to think of creative ways to do it.
Chelsea Metreyeon
Today, we’re chatting with Ben Sondgeroth, on this episode of Teacher Teacher.
Marcus Stein
Hey, friends, and welcome to Teacher Teacher, a podcast for teachers by teachers. I’m Marcus Stein, and I used to teach
Chelsea Metreyeon
and I’m Chelsea Metreyeon. And I also used to teach every episode we’ll be bringing you insights and inspo from educators and experts all around the world,
Marcus Stein
helping you unwind, unpack or simply understand what’s going on out there.
Chelsea Metreyeon
Well, I don’t know about you, Marcus, but I’m excited.
Marcus Stein
Yeah, I’m excited to Let’s Do It.
Chelsea, personally, I love this time of year, like it’s the holidays, but I also reflect a lot on everything that’s happened. Personally, I use the Instagram top nine pictures to look back on the year. And it’s just it’s kind of nostalgic, it’s cute. Is there anything you do have at this time of the year to look back on everything that’s happened,
Chelsea Metreyeon
um, I just kind of sit and reflect a lot during my yoga time. So I know in one of our episodes before we talked about that, and this year, I’m really focusing on the positive because in my personal life, it has been very not good. So I could shift and sit in that negativity, but focusing on all of the positive things that have come up.
Marcus Stein
I’m proud of you, I’m proud of you look at to pivot into positivity. You know, you could try my Instagram trick because all the pictures on my Instagram are beautiful. So maybe just look at my top nine and you’ll be like, yay I’m fine. See, there’s a smile. There’s the smile. And we’re going to continue that smile. We’re going to continue that laughter that love because today’s theme vibe and energy is all about reflecting and setting goals.
Before we jump in, I just want to shout out to Kami for producing this podcast, just like you Kami wants to empower students to love learning in or out of the classroom. Kami can level up the way you teach your feedback and assess head to kamiapp.com To find out more. All right, let’s start the show.
Chelsea Metreyeon
Today we’re chatting to Ben Sondgeroth. Ben began his career as a social studies teacher, eventually transitioning into the role of tech director for the district. Now as the lead regional EdTech coordinator for the Learning Technology Center of Illinois. Ben works with districts on implementing authentic, creative and engaging ways of technology in the classroom. So Ben, we are so excited to have you joining us today. And I do want to say I kind of feel like I’m among Kami royalty right now with you and Marcus. Because if you go on YouTube, and you scroll to the bottom, like it’s you two that have been champion kameez since day one. So first, can you tell us a little bit about yourself who you are what you do kind of what what you enjoy as a human maybe as well?
Ben Sondgeroth
Absolutely. Yeah. Thanks, guys. Happy to be here. with you all. My name is Ben Sondgeroth. And I am the lead Regional Educational Technology Coordinator, which is a mouthful. For an we’re going to get a little more wordy here too for the Learning Technology Center of Illinois. So there are a whole lot of words in that title and in the organization. But yeah, what I get to do is, as a professional in in the EdTech world is I get to support schools and districts all through Northwest Illinois and all things educational technology. So whether that’s it’s a ton of professional development, it’s consulting with schools, making decisions centered around technology. It’s you know, it’s really anything access to funding, support, all that type of stuff we get to do at the LTC it’s a really cool we’re state board of education programs are funded by the state in the public sector and and it’s really great. I like to do it but yeah, I have a pretty long history with Kami. We you know, I remember Jim Knapp, who was one of the oh geez one of the originals with Kami with a he was one of the core for I think one of the first the first four. So Jim actually and I met each other at FETC. And I want to say 20… I think it was 2017. We’d have to check the date on the YouTube clip that’s actually still up from when they interviewed me like in the halls of FETC. Actually, that one might have been SD I don’t know I can’t wait But I think it was, I don’t know anyways, like Jim, Jim, like, just like randomly emailed me and was like, Hey, I see you’re doing this presentation on Chrome apps and extensions. Are you going to talk about Kami? And I actually was like, it was in my presentation. I was like, yeah, he goes, Can I drop some swag off for you to give out to the people? I was like, yeah, like, whatever you want to do, I don’t care, like drop stuff off. And he was late. And he came like sprinting in like, two minutes before the session. It was like, Hey, I’m Jim. Here’s all this stuff from Kami. I was like, Alright, cool. He’s, like, come by the booth later. I was like, Alright. And then from there, I’ve just like, been hanging out at their booth at conferences, like ever since and like, you know, like, getting to know everybody and, and doing stuff with them and being a part of the Kami family. And it’s just been, it’s been really fun. You know, to just get to know everybody over the course of the last, you know, five, six years now, however long it’s been. Yeah, so that’s, that’s kind of like the EdTech. I was a history teacher, high school history teacher, before I got into that EdTech world. was a baseball coach as a baseball player. And so all the stuff if you’re watching a video in the background,
Marcus Stein
What is that? What is that? I have to interrupt you, what is that about coaches in social studies? Is that like some unspoken rule?
Ben Sondgeroth
It is you know, Marcus, I actually wanted to just follow the biggest stereotype out there, and the one that was taken was PE teachers and coaching. And so I went for the one right below it with social studies, teachers and coaching. Yeah, I don’t know. I’m not sure exactly. Maybe it’s because as a history teacher, you don’t have to put a whole lot of effort into learning like new things, because you’re just learning about the stuff that’s already been written. So maybe you can dedicate more time to coaching. I don’t think that’s accurate in any sense of the world capacity. But you know hey!
Marcus Stein
I will say, coaches who do teach social studies, they’re darn good at it. I just noticed that like, it’s a very popular subject area for, for athletic coaches to teach history.
Ben Sondgeroth
You’re right. It’s, you know, when I go and I talked to, like, you know, coaching conventions and stuff, like, hey, what do you do? I’m a Social Studies teacher, and like, Oh, me, too, like, what do you know, and I want to say like, in my class, and I went to a small school, University of Indianapolis, we had like, 5000 kids, there was like, 15 of us in the history ed program, maybe. And over half coached, probably ended up coaching and we’re high school teachers. So yeah, I mean, you’re not wrong. Like it’s definitely yeah, personally, I live in the middle of nowhere, Illinois. Dixon, Illinois. Doing good stuff here. It’s fun. It’s a nice place to live good place to raise a family got a wife and a kid and we have a great time. So that’s basically me in a nutshell.
Chelsea Metreyeon
Oh, I was gonna say probably 2020 He was very busy being in the EdTech world and doing PDs and getting people up and running to this now new normal with bringing more tech into the classroom that should have probably happened many years ago, but now kind of got forced to do
Ben Sondgeroth
I spent more time talking into a camera than an Instagram influencer, uh…
Marcus Stein
We’re glad you’re here.
Ben Sondgeroth
Let me tell you about my makeup routine real quick. Because I know y’all care. There’s foundation and yes, Chelsea. I did. It was I mean, I, you know, we have done some online trainings and things in the past and done some webinars, of course, but I don’t think I could have ever envisioned doing as much online professional development talking into a zoom camera than I did over the course of March of 2020. To still to still ongoing you know, now. Yeah, it was a whole lot, a whole lot of talking to myself, you know, like you just on a zoom call. Everybody turns their camera off. It’s just, you know, I’m just staring at me. It’s like, makeup day. Yeah, exactly. It’s like, but also you’re like, oh, is my like, I don’t have a whole lot of hair. But like, I’m like, is it like my cowlick showing? Like, Oh, I got lower redness going on today is going on, like in like, yeah, probably nobody’s watching, but like, Hey, I’m here. There says there’s a bunch of people on hopefully some are paying attention. So yeah, we were really busy. We did I think. So we were a small, small team at that time. Just to give you a kind of a little bit of peek. I mean, Kami blew up over that time. And we we blew up as an LTC. I think we did. There was about five of us or six of us that was doing a main bulk of the PD. And we did I want to say over 1200 events in a year and close to 16,000 or 17,000 attendees at those events. Between about yeah, like I say about five or six of us that was doing it. And um…
Marcus Stein
So basically a small concert. You definitely.. yeah.
Ben Sondgeroth
Essentially yeah, we had a nice little tour going on. Virtually. Yeah, I’m not getting any royalties off of it.
Marcus Stein
You should friend. You’re that good. You should I’m very happy that you have a good memory, because today is about reflection. Like, I’m glad that you’re able to look back and remember these things. Sometimes I can’t even remember what I ate yesterday. So if we’re thinking about reflecting and looking back is there something that you specifically remember when you look back that is really positive? When you look back on all of this last year, COVID, all of this, is there something you look back on? And you’re like, yeah,
Ben Sondgeroth
Yeah, I like the way you phrase that too, because one of the things, so I’m a big golfer, that’s one of my biggest hobbies that I have. Like, if I was to turn the camera this way, you would see a whole wall lined with photographic photographs of golf courses that I’ve played, I love taking pictures and stuff, like my wife thinks I’m an insane person, because I kind of am. But one of the things in golf is that to be a good golfer, actually, one of the things that mental coaches teach all the time, and the struggle that golfers have is that and I think teachers fall into this trap, too, is that and really just humans, but like, we’re kind of focusing on teachers, and in my case, like the golfing place of this, when you get done with a round of golf, somebody be like, How’d you play, I’m like, Oh, I played pretty good, I shot, whatever I shot. But I made a bogey on this hole, or I hit it out of bounds on this hole. And immediately like, you go back to like, the bad shot that you made in the round of golf. And you don’t say, Well, I birdied though this hole, or I hit like an unbelievable drive. And then I made a great up and down on this hole, like, you go right to like, oh, but it could have been so much better if I would have like, not made bogey there. You know, and, you know, so like, when you I like how you phrase that because I think that’s something that teachers fall into the trap of too of, you know, they’re like, Well, how the year ago like, well, it was pretty good. I survived. But I had six kids out on quarantine last week, or, you know, like, I lost like this many kids moved out of my district. And it’s like, I know, those are bummer things, but like, we got to talk about positive things, like what about the good stuff that happened? You know, and and so, I think when we talk about reflection, like that’s a great way to start it because like too many people automatically go to like, Well, what was the negative thing that happened? It’s, oh
Marcus Stein
Oh we’ll get there. We’ll get there.
Ben Sondgeroth
We can talk. We want to think first about the good, you know, like the good stuff. Um, and so to answer your question, you know, long winded a roundabout way, positively, for me, what I thought was cool was that, like, we did impact like that large number of people, like, you know, like, we we were able to, you know, previous to COVID What was happening was, it was like, hey, we want you to come in and work with this district who wants to come in and work in Illinois, we have these regional offices of education, where we would do a workshop, every 20 people there, maybe, you know, 25, we had a good good session, you know, you go to a school district to work with however many show up for that training, however many admins show up. But like with COVID, what was interesting and in the pandemic, and even now with virtual PD, if we can take a positive out of it is that we can reach a whole lot more people in a you know, without having to travel and we can Zoom professional development is while it may be tiresome now for some people, and I make the joke that I’m tired of talking myself in the camera. It’s true, but actually in the throes of like, early spring, last year, you know, spring of 20, summer of 2020. Even into the fall, I could do a workshop with teachers in one part of the state in the morning, and I could do another one in the afternoon. Whereas previous to that it was like I had to travel someplace I would do the workshop and those 20 teachers were the only 20 teachers that that I was able to affect on that current day. Whereas when it happened, it was like okay, I got a two hour thing in the morning I got a break for lunch. I got a three hour one in the afternoon like let’s go and like next thing you know, you’re you’re affecting, like, you know, multiple teachers across different areas and across different things. So I look at the positives I think like that was really cool thing. You know, like we got to got to connect with a lot of people. And then the positive now that I can also reflect on is yesterday I went to my first in person, like conference like we actually hosted one. And it was so cool. And I know you guys are I assume Chelsea you’re coming FETC too. I know Marcus is gonna be there. I heard that…
Chelsea Metreyeon
Not… Not that one. I’ll be at TCEA and then at CUE, so I’m not going to FETC
Ben Sondgeroth
Okay. Well…
Chelsea Metreyeon
We can fix that, we can fix that…
Ben Sondgeroth
But like, like, like I’m sure Mark is yo yo get this at FETC when you go like, like I went to this conference, it’s just a small Illinois one. There was 300 people there but like I saw so many people like that I hadn’t seen in two years and it was so good. Like it was just like so good. I was like, oh, Melissa. Oh, Steve. Oh, it was like I haven’t seen you guys since literally February of 2020 when the last conference happened and it was like all my EdTech pals and like so like professionally I would say like affecting tons of people was really good. And then just literally yesterday, like yesterday was like, really good.
Marcus Stein
You’re right. You’re absolutely right. Personally, my positive is that I value human interaction a lot more. Yeah, because of what had happened last year in the year before. I really appreciate being in somebody’s presence. So it’s refreshing to see you echo that. So that’s why I wanted to start on positivity, I wanted to just, we had to get the tone real high, real, real positive. Anything you reflect on that might be positive on behalf of the kids.
Ben Sondgeroth
I think what’s positive from the kid perspective is that teachers started adopting technology at like, a, almost a forced rate. But like, that’s a really good thing for the students. Like, it might have been a big stress for teachers, but like, in the end, that’s going to help so many kids out that now they are, they are able to have that technology in their classrooms. Whereas without the pandemic, they might not have got it yet. And so now, like their their their struggle was real to like, it was super hard for those kids like Marcus, you talked about people and connections and valuing those, like, I can’t even imagine what it was like to be a 17 year old kid, a 16 year old kid, and not be able to go hang with your buddies and play ping pong, or, you know, watch a movie or anything like that.
Homecoming? Hello? Prom? Hello?
Yeah, exactly. And like we talked about me being a coach earlier, like all those lost athletic seasons, like that would have just absolutely just destroyed me as a high school kid, if I wouldn’t been able to play. And so having those things back, huge positive. If we’re looking in the educational world, like they get access to tech now, like the stuff that the government did to fund technology to put devices in there to make connectivity issues go away for a lot of the country. Like you talked about the connectivity, the personal connection with students now being back in the classroom and being back at school. I see when my son, my, He’s four years old, he’s in preschool, and like, just this year, like, he’s just so much more talkative, and he’s talking about his friends. And like, you know, I talked to Simon at school, and, you know, all this is like, Yeah, it’s awesome, you know, and like, he just, you know, he, he didn’t have that first semester, last year, when he didn’t go to preschool, you know, and he wasn’t able to so.
Chelsea Metreyeon
Um, so we kind of already spoke how you’re Kami royalty. So this past July, you did your Kami Connect session on the student voice and choice, and how you champion student led learning and kind of with the shift technology, it kind of did help bring that more forward? How does student voice and choice influence the way you should set goals with your students as a teacher?
Ben Sondgeroth
One of the goals that I, you know, I think I would try to, you know, encourage teachers to kind of look at is, like, how can you leverage what you have in your classroom with technology to then meet the needs of those kids, but have those conversations with the students themselves? Like, don’t just anticipate that, like, Hey, I’m gonna make this awesome project, and they’re gonna do it in this platform, and they’re gonna love it. And you didn’t ever talk to them? You know, and like, you do it. And it turns out that it’s kind of trash like, well that didn’t work. It’s like, Yeah, I mean, me too. You know, I’m like, Well, I’m like, so like, I literally try to remember that. It’s like, Well, what did I do is like, oh, yeah, I didn’t talk to the kids. Like, that’s a thing that I should probably do. And I think that comes to the choice component, like, giving them multiple ways of picking how they want to do it, having those conversations. You know, one of the the things that I hear a lot of my friends that are teachers in the classroom right now, echoing is like, you know, they’re, they’re talking about all the kids just like, they’re still not, you know, back to where they were in 2020, 2019, early 2020, pre pandemic, like they’re not, you know, they’re not in school mode yet. And, you know, the kind of the kind of negative connotation like, Well, did you think about the trauma that they suffered, like, you know, and like, they’re, they’re not, they might not still be use to school yet. You know, like, they’re, they’re still kind of, like, remembering what it’s like, and, you know, it’s like, so, you know, talking to the kids having those conversations, I mean, like, what, what makes you tick, you know, what are the things that you want to accomplish within your own standards? Because, like, that’s the thing that teachers go back to is like, well, I have these things I have to teach. And you’re absolutely right, you have to teach those things like that is laid out by state standards and state law in some capacity. But like, you can give opportunities for kids to do it in a way that works hopefully for them within the confines of your curriculum and of your classroom. So, you know, that’s, that’s the thing that I would say is like those conversations with the students around that, you know, go to that So, Marcus, do you have a… Do you have a remembrance of one that particularly failed? Because I’ve got a couple ideas I had.
Marcus Stein
Oh, my gosh, the worst, y’all I thought I was so cool. I thought I was so cool. I like printed out these fake Facebook pages, and we were gonna do like characterization. And I was like, This is gonna be amazing. The kids are gonna love Facebook, it’s social media. Girl, them kids made fun of me, they clown me, they were like Facebook, that’s what ol’ people like, it was terrible. And the fatal mistake I made is I made assumptions. You know, like, I set these goals for these kids and set this bar for these kids. And I never actually checked, like, what is relevant for them? If they had freedom of choice, and were able to express themselves, what would they choose? Not Facebook. I know now. I know now.
Ben Sondgeroth
So I had a, I had a, I actually did that too, with my kids history class. And I have a funny like anecdote about that. So this is actually though this is back in like 2012. So Facebook was so cool, because there wasn’t any alternative yet. You know, like, there wasn’t Instagram was really poppin yet Twitter was, Twitter hadn’t reached the sticks of Illinois yet. Like I had a Twitter account, and the kids couldn’t find me on it. That’s how like, still Twitter wasn’t out in rural Illinois yet. And like I did, like, it was called, like, Fakebook. Like, it was a website, you could go on…
Marcus Stein
Yeah, I think it still exists.
Ben Sondgeroth
Yeah. And like they could make their own little profile. So I actually had them do world leaders. And like from history, so like, I had them like World War Two, I had, like, Hey, make a Facebook page, and have it the Hitler’s Facebook page, but like Stalin’s commenting, and FDR’s commenting, and they really liked it. I didn’t realize that like, fast forward five to seven years to 10 years later now that like our government leaders actually, like, do that now. And like they do comment on social media to each other. And, like, you know, like, oh, like, I thought it was kind of a fun, like, hypothetical. Like, what if our government leaders used social media to like, talk about people and like, oh, they do. Like, that’s a real thing. You know, 10 years later, like they’re actually doing it and yeah, so it was just like, I when you said that social media thing, like I remember back to that one. That was a that was Oh, that’s interesting. I don’t think I could do that now. Like, because a…
Marcus Stein
Very triggered, I feel very triggered. I thought I was so cool… I showed up with a shirt and tie on and everything. I was like, I am going to dress up today.
Ben Sondgeroth
No, I didn’t want to I think mine came to when I had… So I have my first devices. I had iPads. And that was when iPads were the only thing really, you could have laptops, you could have netbooks if you remember those… Or you could have….
Marcus Stein
I had netbooks. We’ll unpack that next episode or something… Crash.
Ben Sondgeroth
How loud those fans spun and this day get… Yeah. Oh, man. So I got iPad twos. And I just like I would say, Alright, guys, we’re gonna do a project and like, do a keynote. And so they would do a keynote on the iPad. And then like, we do the next unit, like, Okay, do a keynote, they will do a keynote. And then I realized, like, listening to 160 keynotes, like every other week was, like the absolute worst as a teacher. I was like, I, it wasn’t maybe so bad for the kids. But like, for me, like I was like, I can’t do this anymore. I can’t sit here and listen to every world history kid, do a keynote for three periods straight. Like we got to, we got to find something else. Like you can’t do a keynote anymore. Do an iMovie do something different. But no more PowerPoints. No more keynotes. We’re done. That’s it.
Chelsea Metreyeon
I love how you just shared your failed teacher lesson and not on the students perspective. Because I couldn’t think of a lesson I taught kindergarten. I was the art teacher for the whole school. So kindergarten through fifth grade. It was fall. And I was like, Oh, I have a great idea. All these kids are going to decorate this outline of a fall leaf and I’m going to make a billboard in the office. They all did it. I didn’t think about who was going to cut out all of the leafs because they didn’t have time to do that. So I spent probably two hours cutting out every single leaf to make the billboard in the office. So I didn’t think through to that step. As a teacher, it was it was a great moment. Yeah.
Marcus Stein
I feel like as adults, we do a pretty good job, especially this time of year of reflecting. I mean, the entire vibe of today’s episode is about reflecting every conversation we’re having is about reflecting on us. But I want to flip it and go back to the kids. How important is it for the kids to reflect at this time of year?
Ben Sondgeroth
So I have a kind of like a session that I do at conferences. I’ve done it a couple of times where like it’s like the art of reflection and talking about just that, like, you know, encouraging students to be reflective. You know, really that session focuses on their learning. And in some of the research that I did for that session, it was pretty eye opening like Like you said, Marcus, like we, as adults, we always like to look back like I don’t know about you guys. But if you remember your sublet or, not your sub plans, but your lesson plans you had to write in college for the College of Education, I’m sure you guys had to do the same thing I had to do where like, it was like they were 13 or 14 pages long and it was always…
Marcus Stein
You’re triggering me again, you’re triggering me.
Ben Sondgeroth
Oh, you’re like me, like you’re done. You’re like, like you’re doing them in real time. You’re like, there’s no way I do this for every lesson. And then you get into teaching, you’re like, yeah, no, no chance. But like, I remember those, if every one of them had a reflection component at the end, that, you know, you had to write a reflection after your lesson and how it went. And I would always get to that point and be like, you know, I was a college kid, I didn’t want to do anything more than I had to. And I’d be like, yeah, why do I have to do one more thing, and then I like started to like, understand that, like, that’s how you learn. Like, you look back, you learned that could be a little bit of a history teacher. And me too. Like we analyze what happened in the past to make better choices in the future. And I think that’s really important for kids to both in the classroom to have them reflect. Now, that’s kind of the whole concept of a study guide before tests, like look back on all the stuff we did, and then it’ll be good to go for the test. But it could be simpler than that. And more condensed or like more a larger picture, you know, of something more creative to then like, Hey, here’s a study guide with 25 questions on it, like fill it out. And remember what everything we did. You know, because that’s that’s how the brain learns. That’s how the brain remembers things is by that reflection, and that going back and remembering what happened, and you know, taking that into account. And so when we talk about doing that with our kids like it’s important, I think to think of creative ways to do it because I you know, like I said, like College Ben didn’t want to reflect College Ben was ready to just like get to the night and go out and play sports.
Marcus Stein
I was ready to get a paycheck. I’m tired of being a broke.
Ben Sondgeroth
That’s right. That’s right. Yeah, I’m tired of paying at Buffalo Wild Wings with a bunch of change.
Marcus Stein
If you don’t stop triggering me. If you don’t stop.
Ben Sondgeroth
got one better for you. I brought my own ranch dressing one time because they were charging 50 cents for ranch. And I brought my own bottle with me. That’s how broke I was at the time. I was like take that B-Dubs I got my own Hidden Valley. I’m taking there right now.
Marcus Stein
Extreme couponers.
Ben Sondgeroth
Yeah. Um, but yeah, so like, thinking of like creative ways to get your kids to reflect because if you tell them like, Hey guys, we’re gonna reflect today. They’re gonna be like, like, what are we doing with that? So I think making like fun activities like getting them like goes kind of back to Chelsea, your question previous about voice and choice, like, Exit Tickets work, teachers like exit tickets, but like, coming up with different ways of getting them to do it. Like, it’s not always just a, hey, write this down, like what you learned today, you know, like, in Kami, you can be like, hey, put an audio comment at the end of our Kami document. And like, just kind of like debrief like what you go over in here, you know, and like, if we kind of big picture that out, you know, at the end of a semester at the end of a unit or at the end of the year, you know, like, hey, reflect back, like, what did you learn? What did you enjoy about this topic? What were some takeaways that you had about science, about math, about history, you know, like about art, like, you know, getting them to go big picture because kids are always like, for the most part, I find their very narrow focus because they’re, you know, they’re young, they’re, they don’t, they just want to get to the next day. And, you know, giving them an outlet. And a way to think back and reflect I think is super important. And being creative in it. Like I said, like that don’t just do the same thing every day, every unit every semester. You know, I think that’s, that’s really important.
Chelsea Metreyeon
And something I always think about, too, is students spend a lot of time at school like a huge chunk of their day. Do you think that there would be importance of having them reflect on things outside of school, like personal goals, maybe goals that they have for sports? Maybe reflecting on the trauma that they may not realize that they had within the last 12 months? Do you think that’s important to bring into the classroom since they spend eight hours plus on that campus?
Ben Sondgeroth
No, I do. I think it’s an I think that’s also like for a teacher like when you’re looking to make those connections with your kids. I think the teachers that students always gravitate towards, they’re the ones that ask them about stuff outside of their classrooms, right, like, and they become human. They humanize the kid, they humanize themselves. You know, I know one of my buddies that I taught with at Morrison like he would start every class I use a business teacher every Monday he just be like, Hey guys, would you guys do this weekend? And like the kids would tell him about their weekend he take five minutes and start every class they talk about their weekend. And I tell you what, everybody loved Mr. Coghlan and I think it’s because he in like I would do a lot of same stuff and like I feel like all I had a great relationship with all my kids too. And it was, you just humanize them, you give them that chance to talk about stuff, because you never know to, like, you know, that what they’re dealing with, like at home, and maybe they don’t have a mom and dad that asked them about, like, what was school like today, or you know, what’s going on in your life, and they’re working all the time, or whatever. And so like, when you give a student a chance to talk about sports, to talk about their weekend to talk about their vacation, you know, it’s important for their development, just as a human, you know, and it’s important for those relationships too. And I think that also, like, we fight, like this concept of teacher burnout, you know, a lot, which is a real thing. And I don’t know, like, I think when I talked to some of my friends that I’ll just, you know, flat out tell ’em, like, I think you’ve lost a little bit of touch with the kids like you, you’re angry, like, I got one that I can think of right now that he just, he’s always bitter. And it’s like, dude, like, I hear some of the stuff you say, it’s like, you got to act like… you’ve lost that connection. And I think asking them to reflect on on some of that, you know, can be really important for everybody’s mental health, you know, going forward of, of talking about that stuff, making those fun things like, that’s why we teach is to affect kids lives. Not because I like to talk about history all the time. Like if I wanted to do that I’d go into academia, and it’s way too boring. So you know, like, so yeah, I think that’s super important, Chelsea, like, making those connections, getting the kids to think back, you know, just developing a well rounded young person, you know, is important.
Marcus Stein
Yet for me, what I what I took away from what you just said is, it’s kind of like the way you ask it, like putting the reflection box at the bottom of the page is not enough. Because if you tell somebody reflect, the kid is just gonna stare at you reflect like a mirror. Like, you know, if you really want to pull it out of them. I think about the first question I asked you, I specifically said, positive, like, I wanted to pull something positive out of you. And so I like your idea that it has to be intentional, but also be aware of what you’re actually asking. Because if you just keep it open ended, they’re gonna stare at you.
Ben Sondgeroth
Exactly. How was school today?
Good
Marcus Stein
good, fine.
Ben Sondgeroth
Fine, What’d you learn?
Stuff.
Marcus Stein
Stuff. Yep.
Ben Sondgeroth
Same wavelength, you know, it’s like, it’s a so here’s, we actually just did for work. For my for the LTC, we have a lady who certified it from kasal, who is specializes in SEL. And she did a quick presentation on trauma and SEL in the classroom for us to kind of understand some things that was her big takeaway Marcus was, was was talking about the right words to use. And I always try to pride myself on that when I do a workshop with teachers of I don’t, I don’t ever call something easy. Because what’s easy for me is not easy for Chelsea, but what’s easy for Chelsea is not going to be easy for me. So that’s a very much a word that like when I say oh, it’s so easy, then people are like when it’s not easy to them. They’re like, Well, I’m dumb. So I’m not going to be able to learn this. So like I very rarely tried to say that I say that word, you know, but I said something. I can’t remember what exactly it was. But I made a statement at the end of our conversation on SEL. And I said, you know, I should be better at doing that. And she came back with your shoulding all over yourself right now. Don’t should on yourself.
Marcus Stein
Mm hmm.
Ben Sondgeroth
And I was like, Okay, it’s kind of funny, because I could never see this lady ever saying a curse word in her entire life. And she just made the innuendo to one. But she’s like, should it has the connotation that you’re not doing enough. And that when you say like, yo, hey, Chelsea, you should be doing some you should be doing this. And Marcus, you should be doing that. You might have that. Like, I kind of like, Oh, but I thought I was like, but I should do more. So I have to do more? Like, you know, and like, you might not feel like you’re getting up to like your potential then. And, you know, that really struck me, you know, I was like, wow, you know, you’re right, you know, like we, we, we need to evaluate those words and those little kind of trigger words that, you know, can set a kid or another adult, another co teacher, or if you’re an admin, you know, going into a classroom being like, you know, you should do this and that teachers like, but I’m trying so hard right now because everything’s so hard. And then you say you should, and they just don’t feel adequate and that can be you know, something that could really help so or it could be a detriment to them. So we think about reflecting you know, maybe we we need to evaluate that in the words that we use and and that type of stuff. So yeah, that’s a that’s a very good point.
Chelsea Metreyeon
And that goes back to that positive thing, shifting everything to positive not that little negative connotation with everything.
Ben Sondgeroth
Yeah, yeah. The other one that I heard was stop using the word but and use now. So like Marcus, you’re doing a great job hosting this podcast. But, you know, you could be a little bit better at this, you can…
Marcus Stein
Well you should have kept that comment to yourself. Heheh.
Ben Sondgeroth
Now, if we just put Chelsea in charge of the podcast that was a little bit, but you know, but like, that’s, that was that was an interesting one that I have also tried to erase from my vocabulary when I’m talking to people like, oh, do that. But you know, if you did this, you know, cuz they’re like, oh I wasn’t doing that already? Now, if you do this, like, you’re like, oh, so I have the first step I’m building on it with uh, now, if you cut, if you put a but in there, you kind of like, cut it off. And it’s not good enough anymore. So like, you know, now do this. So what you were doing was okay, but you can build on that. But if you put the but in there, it’s like, Ah, I don’t, you aren’t quite making it up to where you needed to be. You know, and I have to, like, tell you now because I am better than you. So yeah, I think wording. And I think if we go back to the theme of reflection, that’s a big key, like, the whole reflection thing. Because if your reflection is all I should have done this, I should have done this, I should have done this. Like, all you’re doing is really just you’re you’re not reflecting on the right things, you’re reflecting on ways you could have been better, like you have to look at ways you can improve, but not in the fact that everything was a negative and that you you know, you should have because you can’t like you can’t go back and change. Like you can’t… shoulda woulda coulda, you know, like it’s done. It’s in the past, make the adjustments when you make that come into that equation moving forward. So, yeah, words, words are powerful.
Chelsea Metreyeon
And I liked how you said that now because it is almost like a stepping stone towards your next goal and not just stopping you there. And this kind of brings us kind of do a closing? Do you have any goals that you’ve thought of for yourself next year, I know that I didn’t even realize it’s like mid November and the New Year’s coming soon until I saw this theme for the podcast. And I was like, oh, I should probably like, I don’t do it a lot every year, but start thinking about some goals. So have you thought about any goals for yourself in the coming year, as we close 2021?
Ben Sondgeroth
You know, I always try to set we actually have yearly evaluations for my job, and my boss is super good at being very encouraging. And, you know, he wants us to make sure we do you have measurable goals, like that’s a big thing. We set goals for ourselves, we’re not held, we’re held accountable to them, but not to the point of like, if you don’t achieve this goal, you’re fired, or you get a pay cut, or you know, things like that. It’s more like No, make sure it’s measurable. Like you don’t want to and I think that’s a big key to people too is like I want to lose weight next year. And it’s like…
Marcus Stein
Yes!
Ben Sondgeroth
Great! So what like what does that mean? You know, like, what is, you know, like, if it’s like I lost weight. So if you lost one pound, then you’re like, Well, did you achieve your goal? Because you stepped on the scale and it went from this number to this number, you lost it? But like, are you happy with that goal that you lost one pound, because one pounds, like that’s just like how much water you drink in a day, you know? So like, when you make it measurable. It’s like I want to do this, I want it to be, you know, able to be held accountable to it. I want it to be measurable. And I want it there. And I think that’s really important when people set goals. For me personally, I’ve started to think because I’ve you know, I actually since it is about evaluation time at work, I have to start reflecting on what my goals were last year. And in did I achieve those goals like Did I did I hit those marks that I wanted to. And I think I did like as I’m kind of like going through my brain like I’m pretty sure I met at least two of the three. One of my goals is to work more with administrators this year on supporting their teachers. I think that’s a big thing that you know, administrators have had a very difficult year trying to manage all of the stuff that’s going on with COVID. And you know, teachers in and out no subs, kids quarantine staff quarantine shortage on paraprofessionals. That, that one of my fears as a technology professional is that we go into now a second year of basically people having devices and and no substantial shift in how those devices are being used is as happening. And so I want to my goal is to work continue to work with administrators on building up that capacity for them to lead their staff on making substantial change in how they’re teaching with their kids. So then you’re like, well, then what’s a measurement on that? And mine would be like hosting multiple workshops with regional offices of education in Illinois, for administrators on that, you know, like I’ll set a couple of goals on administrator academies, is what they’re called here in Illinois, on just doing that, you know, and in supporting that so that’s one of my big goals. I think as a profession is focusing on that leadership capacity to empower administrators to to help their staff get better. So like I’ve spent a lot of time with teachers, I want to help the admins now to become more, you know, versed in being able to talk about these technologies to their staff into identify good uses of technology in the classroom. So that’s one of my big goals, I think, you know, and that was one of my goals this year, and I achieved it to a point and I just want to continue, like to grow it like I, you know, and make that more of a steady focus, you know, professionally going forward. So that’s, that’s one of my, my big one, I think, going into 2022.
Chelsea Metreyeon
I really liked how Ben, you said, You reached that goal this year, but you want to expand it into next year. So just because you do reach that goal in one singular year, that doesn’t mean that goal now disappears. And that’s that. So I guess, in terms of my work life, I would just love to continue supporting the teachers that use Kami that I talk to every day. One of my big goals is working more, which is kind of already happening working with those district tech teams, like you said the admin in helping them get the technology working correctly in their classrooms. So this week alone, I talked to two big districts in Texas who really want to work one on one with me to get that support to get them the support down to their teachers and help them understand how to use this technology that they’re now being asked to use. So just continuing that continuing those relationships. Being there when they need me doing demos supporting them any which way. Marcus, what about you?
Marcus Stein
The real reason I asked you to go first, because I didn’t know what I was gonna say. So thank you. I would say my goal for the next year, again, is to continue. Thank you, Ben for that, like I’m not using but I’m going to use now. I want to proactively inspire people more. I’ve realized at this age in my life, as I reflect that, I tend to be like a really positive beacon for people people really be like oh my god Marcus you are so funny, you are so fun. And I’m like, okay, that’s cute, but I’m not a comedian. But I do think there’s something powerful about being an adult who can relax and smile, who can laugh and not take things so seriously. And my goal is to inspire teachers to do the same, that we could sit here all day and do a whole podcast show about all of the negative things that are happening right now. But that’s not my style. That’s not the Marcus Stein brand. So, next year and beyond, I just want to be more proactive about the people I meet, sharing my strategies of how I do stay so upbeat. By the way, I’ve pulled a muscle in my back, and it’s been killing me this entire time. But you would never know you would never know.
Ben Sondgeroth
Didn’t didn’t see that coming at all. No, no,
Marcus Stein
I got my lumbar pillow it’s time to move on. So next year, I just want to share that gift, my gift of positivity and just show people how much of an impact it can have on the rest of the people around you. Especially the kids.
Ben Sondgeroth
Absolutely It’s so important to like, you know, for for everybody to do that. But if you have that power, you know, like and it’s, uh, you know, if you can go spider man, like, with great power comes great responsibility as, as, as long as his grandpa said, like, you know, it’s it’s important, right? Like, I find Marcus, I’m the same way. Like I always tried to be positive. I like people are like, you have so much patience. And I’m like, Well, I wouldn’t have my job if I wasn’t a patient person, because then I’d be a grouch. And nobody want to hire me to do what I do. So like, I have to be patient, like, you know, and yeah, do I like close the car door after workshop and just go, oh, my gosh, what did I just do, but you would never see me do it in person. You know, like, I’m never going to show that. I’m never going to break. I’ve had a couple of times where I’ve been very close. Like I even got called out on at once by the lady who was like organizing it. She’s like you… Oh, she texts me when from the back of the room. She’s like, you almost broke there, didn’t you? I’m like, Yeah, that was though I walked 7000 steps in a five hour workshop around a conference room. 7000 steps in a conference room because of all of the questions that were being asked. And it was tough. Anyways, that’s a whole nother story. We could talk about that.
You know we’re gonna have you back, we’re gonna have to do this again. We’re going to have a Part 2 where we just dish… They’re just gonna call it like the dish episode where we just go off about all these experiences. But what makes us all common here is this emphasis on: We’re reflecting. We’re looking back, but we’re smiling. We’re smiling as we look back.
Yep
Marcus Stein
I like that.
Ben Sondgeroth
Yep. Yeah, you have to like it’s just you know, like What’s What’s the purpose of being a grumpy person in life? You know, and like thinking about the negatives and like all that, like, like, why be miserable? Like, you only get so much time on this rock? You know, like, anyways, you know, not to get real meta on everybody, but and not the Facebook, rebranding, but like you know, like, really like, that’s kind of how, like when Vanessa reached out about like the topic and she’s like, we think it’d be good. I was like, Yeah, I’d love being like, reflective and positive and looking at things. And, you know, like, it’s just, we’re here, like, let’s have a good time and have fun and enjoy it and see where see where everything leads. And I appreciate, you know, YouTube sharing that positivity and that light because it is it is super important, especially around education. That’s super hard right now, for a lot of people and I and I understand that, you know, it’s probably hard for a lot of people to go home positive after a day in a classroom. You know, and you know, personally, I think I have actually the book right here.
Marcus Stein
Come on
Ben Sondgeroth
Maybe not I can find it quick. Yeah, I don’t know it’s in this… but look at all these Kami stickers that I actually…
Marcus Stein
I didn’t know it was show and tell time…
Ben Sondgeroth
I was looking for something else. And I found a bunch of Kami stickers that I probably got sent right before…
Marcus Stein
I have my own like Kami Hero little decal. Yeah. OG. It’s the OGs baby.
Chelsea Metreyeon
Told you, Kami Royalty!
Ben Sondgeroth
And that was not planted there by any means, it just sits on my desk. I don’t know I can’t find I was gonna say like, I just had a book where from when I was student teaching that a kid wrote in there like, I this kid rarely talked. But he was like, in all my cooperating teacher did some really cool where she had the kids like, right in this like little journal about like, what I meant to them as a student teacher. And it was awesome. And like, I’ve got it, I just, you know, I wasn’t prepared for a prop. But like, it was really neat. Because like they wrote in it, like, you know, we really liked you. It was great. You were awesome. You were so fun. And so like you get down with eight weeks of teaching, you know, student teaching, that’s really hard. And you don’t know if you did anything right or not. And you got to read it. It was so neat. And one of the kids wrote in there. And he’s like, I remember he wrote something and I like wrote on his like, gave him feedback. I was like, you’re really good writer. Like, you know, you should do this more. And like he wrote in that book, he never said anything to me in person. But he wrote in that book, that little journal, like, Thanks for telling me I was a good writer, no one had ever told me that before. And I was like, Whoa, like, this is pretty cool. Like as a, you know, like, as a human as a teacher. I was like, this is neat. You know, like I you know, that was that impact moment, right? Of like, it’s there. And, and I worry that sometimes maybe teachers aren’t getting that impact moment because masks in school, they’re not seeing facial expressions, they’re, you know, and we all worked for technology companies, but like sometimes tech eliminate some of that personality, personal touch a little bit of different things. And, and so like finding ways of reconvening that, I think is important to reflect on to have a little bit so so yeah,
Marcus Stein
It’s kind of forced the reflection on you. Like their gift to you was the reflection that you didn’t know you needed? Yes, that’s a beautiful thing. Shout out. Yeah, teachers who do that. Ask the kids to make a scrapbook. My kids made me a scrapbook at the end of the year one time, and it was just all these gushing comments about moments that I totally forgotten about throughout the year. Yeah. And so teachers, if y’all are looking for a way to know how you doing, ask your kids.
Ben Sondgeroth
Yeah. And if you see if you’re a teacher, and you see one of your colleagues, that’s like down about it, figure out a way to maybe do that for them. Right, like, like, go behind them a little bit, get to their class, somehow get to some of their favorite students create something for them that they don’t know that’s coming from their kids. And that could make a big difference to you know,
Marcus Stein
Write that down, everybody so write that down. That is like that is a Teacher Appreciation gift. Like that. 100% that is invaluable. Yep. Wow, I’m glad we got that moment because now I like to call all my friends classrooms and say reflect on the teacher because I still cry when I look back on that scrapbook.
Ben Sondgeroth
Yeah, I still have it somewhere. I swear its in this drawer.
Marcus Stein
Mines over there. Yeah.
I feel like we taught at the same school then I feel like you and I had a similar experiences. Yeah, and I appreciate it man, I appreciate it.
Ben Sondgeroth
Yeah, right.
Chelsea Metreyeon
I feel like I needed to get my teaching credential in Illinois because I did way more than eight weeks of student teaching here in California.
Ben Sondgeroth
I did 16
Okay
I did 16. I had to do eight at a high school and eight at a middle school. So I split them.
Chelsea Metreyeon
So that’s the same here. Cuz I was like, wait a second.
Marcus Stein
They were the longest 16 weeks of my life, I was so broke, I ran out of outfits. I was like, I’m a college student. I’m wearing the same Old Navy pants every day with the same polo the kids wear like, I was basically wearing a uniform shirt.
Ben Sondgeroth
Yeah.
Marcus Stein
Broke.
Ben Sondgeroth
Yep.
Marcus Stein
I am so glad we are discussing this topic, especially at the end of the school year. Reflecting can be a scary thing. But it can also be a really positive thing. So I’m really thankful we had been today for reminding all of us about your word choice when you’re choosing to reflect. So thank you. Thank you, Ben.
Chelsea Metreyeon
And Marcus, you took my idea, I really loved the shift to now. And thinking about how your goals like I said previously don’t have to disappear. You can continue building on those. So thank you for shifting my personal mindset.
Ben Sondgeroth
Well, I will throw the thanks right back at you guys. For for, for having me being very easy and fun to talk to. And, and also for thinking of this topic because it’s a it’s a super important one. I’m not one to be like a kind of like a hippie mindset or anything like that. But I’m all about the good vibes. So
Chelsea Metreyeon
I just raise my hand I was like I am!
Marcus Stein
Yeah, I’m a bit of a tree hugger over here. So big, big thank you, Ben. Big thank you for being here, friend.
Friends, it’s time for us to go. Womp, womp. But we’ll be back.
Chelsea Metreyeon
Thanks to our fabulous guest. It’s been awesome chatting with you today.
Marcus Stein
Everybody out there. Listen, we want to hear your thoughts on this episode. You can catch us on the social medias, as @kamiapp.
Chelsea Metreyeon
and make sure you use #TeacherTeacher
Marcus Stein
and if you need the show notes, the transcript or other resources we got you head over to our website kamiapp.com/podcast for all of the podcast goodness
Chelsea Metreyeon
Teacher Teacher was brought to you by Kami and interactive learning platform with intuitive tools to not only help you reimagine lessons, assignments and feedback, but to help your students love learning.
Marcus Stein
This episode was hosted by my girl Chelsea Metreyeon and yours truly, Marcus Stein.
Chelsea Metreyeon
Catch you next time.
Marcus Stein
See ya friends